Mercedes AMG Classic

[attachment=0]Motor-Nr..jpg[/attachment]

Got a message from Mercedes Classic. An M 104.980 3606 cm³ AMG with Bosch KE-Jetronic does not exist.

[img]http://oi68.tinypic.com/e80j0k.jpg[/img]

Maybe a possible AMG 3.6 980 engine is related to this RENNtech 3.6? Since RENNtech owner Hartmut Feyhl is former AMG. It´s a small world after all, isn't it! ;)

[img]http://oi68.tinypic.com/24ms5fb.jpg[/img]

And that RENNtech 3.6 probably has these specs.

[img]http://oi63.tinypic.com/23ixqnq.jpg[/img]

Although these 91 x 92,4 mm are from a M 103 RENNtech engine, i have strong reason to believe they will be similar to a M 104.

[quote="weide1"] You misread a B for an 8. [/quote]
LOL, of course, I was drunk :lol: 11 character of VIN must be a letter - production plant 8-)
I'm not specialist about M103/M104, more about M117 ;) I'll look more about that in AMG brochures or press packs, maybe it will be some info.

KubaSEC, except for the 3.4 liter these are M 103 engines. The engines that i am refering to are M104.

VIN is WDB1240311[b]B[/b]556284. You misread a B for an 8. Decoder says 300 E-24. Date 06-1991.
According to the owner, and confirmed by AMG Aftersales, car got a 3.4 in 1993. And a 3.6 in 1996. The last engine change is confirmed in the Fahrzeugbrief. Date 01-1996.

Strange however is why the 3.4 is not registered in the Fahrzeugbrief. And afterwards crossed out when the 3.6 was placed. Crossed out just like the initial 3.0 factory engine.

The other question is, did a 3.6 AMG engine also exist in the 1st generation M 104 version?
Brabus did have a 3.6 in both versions.
[img]http://oi64.tinypic.com/i1k9vm.jpg[/img]

And AMG had more engines that are not that well known. Like this 3527 cm³ version.
[img]http://oi66.tinypic.com/25gqcd1.jpg[/img]

So a 3.6 AMG in the 1st M 104 version wouldn't surprise me. A stamped engine number could confirm this.

First of all, if I'm reading the VIN right as a WDB12403118556284 (? :roll: ), it is invalid VIN - no exist in MB database.
During EPC 124031 is "300 E-24, AMG 300 E 3.4", but if initial registration was 06/1991 so it started life as a standard 300E-24 and in Affalterbach the could do anything with it... :roll: Absolutely not E36.

And I don't know how it was in 1991, but 1990 price list for 300 E/CE/TE , 300 E/CE/TE KAT shows:

Leistungssteigerung auf
165 KW (225 PS) ohne KAT
158 KW (21 5 PS) mit KAT
bei 6000 min -1 (without displacement change)

Leistungssteigerung auf
180 KW (245 PS) ohne KAT
172 KW (234 PS) mit KAT
bei 5 750 min -1 durch Umbau auf 3,2 (with displacement change to 3,2)

and only for 300 E/CE/TE- 24
Leistungssteigerung auf
200 KW (272 PS) mit KAT
bei 6500 min -1 durch Umbau auf 3,4 (with displacement change to 3,4)

I found the same sticker but in better condition:
[img]http://tuning1.net/img/mercedes/mercedes-benz_mercedes-benz_e-class_coupe_355573.jpg[/img]
[img]http://tuning1.net/img/mercedes/mercedes-benz_mercedes-benz_e-class_coupe_477308.jpg[/img]

This is what I have seen as E36 engine (two of those) - this is by the way the one of the white E36 Kombi on sale at Mobile.de. The car is originally from Japan, I have seen it.

I don't understand those guys at Autohaus Grieb too. My conclusion is they have something to hide. But maybe i'm wrong.

Therefore i think it would be an idea if people from this forum send an email to Autohaus Grieb. And inquire on this car too. Maybe you guys have more luck. And maybe Autohaus Grieb will send the stamped engine number to you. Since my relation with them is sadly enough disdurbed.

The engine in this car is, if it is really a genuine AMG M 104.980 3606 cm³ KE Jetronic version, simply too important too ignore. Especially on an AMG Classic Forum ofcourse.

You can use the email button on the mobile.de and on the autoscout24.de advertisement.
Further you can use the adress from the actual salesman that i contacted: mario.hoesl@autohaus-grieb.de.
Or the adress from the owner of Autohaus Grieb: siegmund.grieb@autohaus-grieb.de.

Together we must be able to find solid confirmation that a 3.6 AMG engine also exists in a 980 KE version. Since this is true AMG Engine History that one never reads about.

Yeah, this was my car engine number :))))
I finally sold it.....

I d'ont understand why a dealer would think that sbody will spend 25k just for fun, because a w124 has an amg steering wheel.... this is a lot of money! Crazy people, crazy momentum....

Indeed it certainly would. But Autohaus Grieb won't give this stamped engine number. Which feeds my suspicion even more. I asked for several times. I even showed them an example of a similar 3.4. To show what i mean. But they still won't give. "This is probably not the car you're looking for" they replied. Maybe they thought i'd be an easy client that didn't do some research first. I can only guess. :?

It would be nice to see what is stamped on the engine block, under the official engine number...

Peter, i still read 3606 as displacement in the Fahrzeugbrief.

And the VIN WDB124031... is correct since the car initially was a 300 E - 24. You can see the K162/6400 and 2960 still as data in the Fahrzeugbrief. Although crossed out. But still visible.

Owner claims in 1993 car got a 3.4 liter AMG engine. And in 1996 car got a 3.6 liter AMG engine. This is confirmed by AMG Aftersales.
The car having received in 1996 a 3.6 liter AMG is confirmed in the Fahrzeugbrief. Upt till that no question.

But both the Fahrzeugbrief and AMG Aftersales do not show how that AMG 3.6 Liter engine looks like. The engine pic in the ad does.
And that is just it. Was there a AMG 3.6 of the first generation M 104 engines? Fahrzeugbrief and engine pic seem to confirm this.

Or is something else the matter. The AMG 3.6 as based on the 3.2 Liter got broke. And was switched to a first generation M104 3 liter. Or 3.4 liter. But that engine change was never registered in the Fahrzeugbrief.

This is illegal ofcourse. An engine stamp could solve this. But the current owner wont give this. Creating doubt. Is he hiding this engine change?

This is not a factory E36. Should be WDB124092... engine also looks very different as the E36 is based on the 3.2L

https://suchen.mobile.de/fahrzeuge/details.html?id=262438486&damageUnrepaired=NO_DAMAGE_UNREPAIRED&isSearchRequest=true&makeModelVariant1.makeId=17200&makeModelVariant1.modelId=59&pageNumber=1&scopeId=C&sortOption.sortBy=specifics.firstRegistration&sortOption.sortOrder=ASCENDING&searchId=5b81e541-c623-2c58-f73d-653f4a5d27fb

If you see the Fahrzeugbrief, you read 3606 displacement and 195 kW at 5500 rpm. If you look at the engine, you see a KE Jetronic 980 version.
Big question now, does a 980 KE Jetronic AMG 3.6 really exist? Since the well know AMG 3.6 is a HFM 992 version.

And if such a AMG 3.6 KE Jetronic 980 does really exist, why does it have 5500 rpm? The AMG and Mercedes factory 980 engines have 6400 to 6500 rpm.

I asked current owner BMW Service Grieb for more information and images. Like stamped engine number. But i get no for answer. Privacy they say.
Makes me very suspicious. Are they hiding something? Combined with the question of the 5500 rpm, i get a strange feeling of this car. Was there an engine swap? Is the engine in the Fahrzeugbrief the same as the engine in the advertisement?

Anybody here that knows more?